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Hrolf The Ganger 14 Jun 16 1.29pm | |
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Originally posted by johnfirewall
Stop being cnuts. I blame the sort of politics which fails to address why people are being cnuts. I was concerned for a second I'd crossed over to the left in wanting a degree of unity whereby we are just one people, but surely to facilitate that you'd require a two way process which would involve atheists absorbing elements of various religions and I'm not up for the homophobia, or a lot of the other aspects. Maybe a one way process then? But you can't tell people their beliefs are wrong. As if. It has to be a one way process because in the end not all attitudes are compatible. I for one am not going to yield to a return to backward attitudes on the basis of irrational religious faith. You cannot directly tell people what to believe but you can slowly change the mechanisms that make them believe what they do. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (14 Jun 2016 1.39pm)
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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 14 Jun 16 1.31pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Stop people with a history of violence, mental health problems and who appear on FBI terrorism watch lists from buying assault rifles and firearms would probably be a start. Abso fcukin lutley correct Whilst the individual was clearly inspired by IS, and radical Islam, he wasn't actually a member of any terrorist group or affiliation. In fact it seems he may well have not been all that much of a radical Muslim either, given he was a regular at Pulse and had been known to get drunk there, and used a gay dating app. Thats hair splitting, just because you are not a player doesn't mean you can't be a fan and try to emulate your hero's. As is the case every Sunday morning when parks the country wide full of beer bellied 40 some-things who "could have gone pro".
All that shows is that he was violent coward from the offs. Something you tend to see in spree shootings, is mentally unravelled people, associating themselves to extremist agendas, that effectively justify their rage. Neo-Nazism, nihilism and fundamentalism often appeal to people who have experienced a psychotic episode because it provides proof that their paranoia and delusions are not false, and offers a 'solution'. Delete Solution insert excuse. My argument has always been that this particular brand of sky fairy and its followers are abhorrent, his own father tries to deflect the blame away onto the night club for not strip searching people on a night out the pr1ck. The attack bears far more similarity to other Spree shootings in the US, than to terrorism. The idea of the 'lone wolf' terrorist, has become a convenient means of explaining away what are very serious issues in the US around hate, violence, guns, mental health and race. I think your under estimating the religious angle here, that nigt club was targeted by a man who made a phone call claiming it was all for Allah etc etc then killed in cold blood 49 Gay people who are not supposed to exist in his version of god. Sad backward fcking idiots. Its no more an act of terrorism than the Columbine shootings were. I think your wrong there. Its pretty clear that he 'self identified' to IS, rather than was actually part of it (even is declaration of support was incorrectly presented. It was still presented and used as the driving force behind the attack, to dismiss it is sticking head in sand time. why ? 49 dead is 49 dead whatever the reason.
"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'" |
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Stuk Top half 14 Jun 16 2.03pm | |
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Originally posted by Part Time James
The colour of them or their aura? I don't know about the colour of their aura, but they definitely need to have greenbacks, and plenty of them.
Optimistic as ever |
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Stuk Top half 14 Jun 16 2.06pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Its also interesting how the media have focused on projecting this attack as being 'the second worst terrorist attack' on the US. It kind of seems very dismissive of the fact that McVey killed 169 and injured several hundreds, as part of a Christian Militia attack on the US government infrastructure. Like people forget football existed before 1992, Americans forget anything happened before 2001.
Optimistic as ever |
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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 14 Jun 16 2.22pm | |
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Any thoughts on Owen Jones's strop on sky because the presenters refused to accept that it was a homophobic attack?
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-TUX- Alphabettispaghetti 14 Jun 16 2.31pm | |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Any thoughts on Owen Jones's strop on sky because the presenters refused to accept that it was a homophobic attack? A bit of a hissy-fit as this had fk'all to do with ISIS.
Time to move forward together. |
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Hrolf The Ganger 14 Jun 16 2.47pm | |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Any thoughts on Owen Jones's strop on sky because the presenters refused to accept that it was a homophobic attack? I think Owen Jones is a typical young left wing twit and walking out of a TV debate won't help his cause. That said, to deny that this was a homophobic attack is just ignoring the evidence.
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We are goin up! Coulsdon 14 Jun 16 2.53pm | |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Any thoughts on Owen Jones's strop on sky because the presenters refused to accept that it was a homophobic attack?
Quelle surprise.
The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money. |
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blackpalacefan 14 Jun 16 2.53pm | |
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i dont think we can blame it all on isis, gun laws, conflicts with his sexuality, his odd father. its a toxic mix of all of these and people pick out the bits that fit with their feelings and politics
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jamiemartin721 Reading 14 Jun 16 3.13pm | |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Yes. We are battling an idea, not an organisation in the traditional sense. It often comes down to identification with a particular ideology. We must cut the head off(ironically)this many tentacled beast and hope it dies. What we can't do is live in denial about the spread of this cancer among certain sections of the population. We can't keep blaming it on mental health and somehow disassociating it from radical Islam. It is the common denominator. If radical Islam ceases to exist then this particular problem goes away. But in doing so, its essential that we do not end up pushing people into the arms of radicals by alienating them. Its also very important I would argue, as well, to cut off the accessibility of potential suspects and people with mental illness to such weapons. Its absurd in the US that you can be on a no fly list, and buy firearms (a bill to prevent which was shot down by the Republican party). Problem is radical Islam isn't going anywhere. Its in Iran, Kuwait, Saudi and UAE. In Palestine, Hamas, are a popular faction. Even our 'allies' in the war against IS consist of Shia militias that are radical Islamist movements (which also comprise a part of the 'Rebel Forces'). IS and Al-Qaeda affiliates are just another face of a much greater issue. Islamist movements in these countries remain the only real source of a 'social justice' within corrupt and murderous regimes that themselves implement extreme Muslim tennets.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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jamiemartin721 Reading 14 Jun 16 3.15pm | |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
I think Owen Jones is a typical young left wing twit and walking out of a TV debate won't help his cause. That said, to deny that this was a homophobic attack is just ignoring the evidence. It was a homophobic attack. That doesn't mean it cannot be a terrorist attack or the work of a mentally ill person.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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johnfirewall 14 Jun 16 3.20pm | |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Any thoughts on Owen Jones's strop on sky because the presenters refused to accept that it was a homophobic attack? What they rejected was that it was a personal attack on Owen Jones. It was a homophobic attack, which according to his father came as a result of him seeing to blokes kissing. Worth noting that his father also states that homosexuals will be punished by god. Where do these ideas come from? Thanks for playing devil's advocate but we've already addressed the root of these ideas, and that the bloke was mental (i.e. a prime candidate for brainwashing), and that guns and the bus driver played a part. Edited by johnfirewall (14 Jun 2016 3.22pm)
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