Southampton vs Palace Match Thread

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Southampton vs Palace Match Thread

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Tickled pink Cornwall 31 Dec 19 6.20pm
Also how can anyone clearly say when the ball was actually struck for the pass ..at what moment do we actually decide to scrutinise the positions and that would also depend on the speed the ball was played forward, the worst looking decision for me was the Norwich one because the player is a long way behind with his arm being penalised simply because he is leaning forward more and that is ridiculous when considering Zaha's one.
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Tickled pink

Cornwall 31 Dec 19 6.20pm

Also how can anyone clearly say when the ball was actually struck for the pass ..at what moment do we actually decide to scrutinise the positions and that would also depend on the speed the ball was played forward, the worst looking decision for me was the Norwich one because the player is a long way behind with his arm being penalised simply because he is leaning forward more and that is ridiculous when considering Zaha's one.

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Tickled pink Cornwall 31 Dec 19 6.43pm
Originally posted by Putitout That has been the subject of many a rant ,ever since the offside rules were first devised. It will never change . Just checking if a piece of the attacker ,significant to the average eye, can be identified, should be fair. It will never satisfy everyone but you would have the pictures to justify the decision . What we have now is thought to be accurate ,but minute, to the degree ,that many believe it shouldn’t count enough to wipe out what in every other respect is a perfectly good goal. Luckily VAR is adaptable, if the rules are clarified, it should not be a problem. While they are at it, get rid of disallowing perfectly good goals , because the ball has hit a hand/arm without it being deliberate. Good points but we are forgetting the hard work defenders put into training to making sure they play the opposition offside and it's extremely difficult to be scrutinising the ball going over the goal line and then not doing the same during an offside that leads directly to the ball going over the goal line, we have let the cat out of the bag! ..we mustn't also forget that one club is going to be deliriously relieved with VAR with every decision, maybe we should just get used to this because ultimately getting the right decision is definitely happening every time whether we like it or not as it stands no matter how painful it is going to be when it goes against.
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Tickled pink

Cornwall 31 Dec 19 6.43pm

Originally posted by Putitout

That has been the subject of many a rant ,ever since the offside rules were first devised. It will never change .
Just checking if a piece of the attacker ,significant to the average eye, can be identified, should be fair. It will never satisfy everyone but you would have the pictures to justify the decision .
What we have now is thought to be accurate ,but minute, to the degree ,that many believe it shouldn’t count enough to wipe out what in every other respect is a perfectly good goal.
Luckily VAR is adaptable, if the rules are clarified, it should not be a problem. While they are at it, get rid of disallowing perfectly good goals , because the ball has hit a hand/arm without it being deliberate.

Good points but we are forgetting the hard work defenders put into training to making sure they play the opposition offside and it's extremely difficult to be scrutinising the ball going over the goal line and then not doing the same during an offside that leads directly to the ball going over the goal line, we have let the cat out of the bag! ..we mustn't also forget that one club is going to be deliriously relieved with VAR with every decision, maybe we should just get used to this because ultimately getting the right decision is definitely happening every time whether we like it or not as it stands no matter how painful it is going to be when it goes against.

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rollercoaster Cornwall 31 Dec 19 7.54pm
Originally posted by Tickled pink Good points but we are forgetting the hard work defenders put into training to making sure they play the opposition offside and it's extremely difficult to be scrutinising the ball going over the goal line and then not doing the same during an offside that leads directly to the ball going over the goal line, we have let the cat out of the bag! ..we mustn't also forget that one club is going to be deliriously relieved with VAR with every decision, maybe we should just get used to this because ultimately getting the right decision is definitely happening every time whether we like it or not as it stands no matter how painful it is going to be when it goes against. Not right, showing if a ball crosses the goalline is more straight forward and is done automatically and relatively instantly by the technology. Tight offsides require the opinion of a video ref looking at 12 camera angles for about 5 minutes. The fact is that the technology we have isn't yet good enough for tight offsides but is good enough for obvious errors for which it should be used.
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rollercoaster

Cornwall 31 Dec 19 7.54pm

Originally posted by Tickled pink

Not right, showing if a ball crosses the goalline is more straight forward and is done automatically and relatively instantly by the technology. Tight offsides require the opinion of a video ref looking at 12 camera angles for about 5 minutes. The fact is that the technology we have isn't yet good enough for tight offsides but is good enough for obvious errors for which it should be used.

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Putitout Oxford 31 Dec 19 8.19pm
Clear and obvious, should mean, something anyone with acceptable eye sight could see. As it stands goals are ruled out without anyone being able to actually see anything. Only with the aid of geometric patterns applied to photo images can a decision be reached. To me this applies rules in a way that should only apply to robots, not surprising I suppose as a lot of players now a days are treated by there clubs and a good many fans as such.
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Putitout

Oxford 31 Dec 19 8.19pm

Clear and obvious, should mean, something anyone with acceptable eye sight could see. As it stands goals are ruled out without anyone being able to actually see anything. Only with the aid of geometric patterns applied to photo images can a decision be reached.
To me this applies rules in a way that should only apply to robots, not surprising I suppose as a lot of players now a days are treated by there clubs and a good many fans as such.

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Putitout Oxford 31 Dec 19 8.21pm
Originally posted by Putitout Clear and obvious, should mean, something anyone with acceptable eye sight could see. As it stands goals are ruled out without anyone being able to actually see anything. Only with the aid of geometric patterns applied to photo images can a decision be reached. To me this applies rules in a way that should only apply to robots, not surprising I suppose as a lot of players now a days are treated by their clubs and a good many fans as such.
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Putitout

Oxford 31 Dec 19 8.21pm

Originally posted by Putitout

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Tickled pink Cornwall 01 Jan 20 12.03am
Originally posted by rollercoaster Not right, showing if a ball crosses the goalline is more straight forward and is done automatically and relatively instantly by the technology. Tight offsides require the opinion of a video ref looking at 12 camera angles for about 5 minutes. The fact is that the technology we have isn't yet good enough for tight offsides but is good enough for obvious errors for which it should be used. Yes I agree but as it is this is what they are actually attempting to do, the problem is of achieving the clarity of ball over the line with that of offside using the same method, ultimately they are actually achieving this because Zaha was offside.
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Tickled pink

Cornwall 01 Jan 20 12.03am

Originally posted by rollercoaster

Yes I agree but as it is this is what they are actually attempting to do, the problem is of achieving the clarity of ball over the line with that of offside using the same method, ultimately they are actually achieving this because Zaha was offside.

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Tickled pink Cornwall 01 Jan 20 12.05am
If Meyer's goal was allowed Southampton would be the team screaming and shouting wouldn't they because Jack Stevens did his job.
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Tickled pink

Cornwall 01 Jan 20 12.05am

If Meyer's goal was allowed Southampton would be the team screaming and shouting wouldn't they because Jack Stevens did his job.

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Tickled pink Cornwall 01 Jan 20 12.06am
..just.
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Tickled pink

Cornwall 01 Jan 20 12.06am

..just.

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Phil’s Barber Crowborough 01 Jan 20 12.13pm
Originally posted by Willo What is interesting is that the debate about VAR suggested that any controversy would be about subjective decisions and matters of FACT would be accepted as it is with goalline technology. At present of course the furore is about FACT ie a player is seen to be offside or not.It is the miniscule margins that is causing the controversy and I don't recall this scenario being part of any debate. Edited by Willo (30 Dec 2019 11.29am) As far as I am aware it has been discussed at great length, the review of marginal decisions taking so long to adjudicate and causing an unnecessary and inappropriate delay to the game has been a major factor, if not THE major factor in people’s criticism and objection to VAR since well before it’s introduction. The unnatural hold up in the game has always been debated and a short pause was considered generally acceptable but nothing significant, which is why the 90 second plus ones we are seeing are being so heavily criticised.
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Phil’s Barber

Crowborough 01 Jan 20 12.13pm

Originally posted by Willo

What is interesting is that the debate about VAR suggested that any controversy would be about subjective decisions and matters of FACT would be accepted as it is with goalline technology.
At present of course the furore is about FACT ie a player is seen to be offside or not.It is the miniscule margins that is causing the controversy and I don't recall this scenario being part of any debate.

Edited by Willo (30 Dec 2019 11.29am)

As far as I am aware it has been discussed at great length, the review of marginal decisions taking so long to adjudicate and causing an unnecessary and inappropriate delay to the game has been a major factor, if not THE major factor in people’s criticism and objection to VAR since well before it’s introduction.

The unnatural hold up in the game has always been debated and a short pause was considered generally acceptable but nothing significant, which is why the 90 second plus ones we are seeing are being so heavily criticised.

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Phil’s Barber Crowborough 01 Jan 20 12.33pm
Originally posted by Tickled pink Good points but we are forgetting the hard work defenders put into training to making sure they play the opposition offside and it's extremely difficult to be scrutinising the ball going over the goal line and then not doing the same during an offside that leads directly to the ball going over the goal line, we have let the cat out of the bag! ..we mustn't also forget that one club is going to be deliriously relieved with VAR with every decision, maybe we should just get used to this because ultimately getting the right decision is definitely happening every time whether we like it or not as it stands no matter how painful it is going to be when it goes against. As has already been highlighted on many occasions, VAR is not getting it right on offside decisions because of the margin of error with freeze frame technology and this has been accepted by those involved with the technology. It cannot show precisely when the ball leaves a players foot/head/chest etc. And it cannot show unequivocally where the attackers armpit or toe is in relation to the last defender. It has been discussed at great length that there is anything from a 13cm and 38.8cm margin of error with the freeze frame technology and you simply cannot use VAR to adjudicate on the marginal offside decisions with such a degree of uncertainty as that. [Link] [Link] [Link] [Link]
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Phil’s Barber

Crowborough 01 Jan 20 12.33pm

Originally posted by Tickled pink

As has already been highlighted on many occasions, VAR is not getting it right on offside decisions because of the margin of error with freeze frame technology and this has been accepted by those involved with the technology.

It cannot show precisely when the ball leaves a players foot/head/chest etc. And it cannot show unequivocally where the attackers armpit or toe is in relation to the last defender.

It has been discussed at great length that there is anything from a 13cm and 38.8cm margin of error with the freeze frame technology and you simply cannot use VAR to adjudicate on the marginal offside decisions with such a degree of uncertainty as that.

[Link]

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Tickled pink Cornwall 01 Jan 20 8.57pm
Originally posted by Phil’s Barber As has already been highlighted on many occasions, VAR is not getting it right on offside decisions because of the margin of error with freeze frame technology and this has been accepted by those involved with the technology. It cannot show precisely when the ball leaves a players foot/head/chest etc. And it cannot show unequivocally where the attackers armpit or toe is in relation to the last defender. It has been discussed at great length that there is anything from a 13cm and 38.8cm margin of error with the freeze frame technology and you simply cannot use VAR to adjudicate on the marginal offside decisions with such a degree of uncertainty as that. [Link] [Link] [Link] [Link] But, as this system is up and running now we have to carry on with it until the end of the season because all the clubs have already colluded by playing with it, so although not getting it right it is getting it right in as much as everyone is agreeing to it being right as it stands today lol Edited by Tickled pink (01 Jan 2020 9.02pm)
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Tickled pink

Cornwall 01 Jan 20 8.57pm

Originally posted by Phil’s Barber

It cannot show precisely when the ball leaves a players foot/head/chest etc. And it cannot show unequivocally where the attackers armpit or toe is in relation to the last defender.

[Link]

But, as this system is up and running now we have to carry on with it until the end of the season because all the clubs have already colluded by playing with it, so although not getting it right it is getting it right in as much as everyone is agreeing to it being right as it stands today lol

Edited by Tickled pink (01 Jan 2020 9.02pm)

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