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Hoof Hearted 17 Nov 16 11.21am | |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Why, has he got a green door?
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jamiemartin721 Reading 17 Nov 16 11.27am | |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Why, has he got a green door? Boom-tish
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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Hrolf The Ganger 17 Nov 16 2.23pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Nationalism can be a good thing, but in the UK it does tend to get used to justify all the things people don't like and don't want, rather than being about the positive aspects of nationhood. I've met some, and there are some on here, who have a positive ideal of nationalism. But for many it seems to hide a thinly veiled excuse for hate, spite and their own insecurities. There is some truth in what you say and there will be those using the new Brexit, Trump world and an excuse to abuse minorities. Those kind of bullies need to be put in their place by the law and indeed those on the right of politics.
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jamiemartin721 Reading 17 Nov 16 2.45pm | |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
There is some truth in what you say and there will be those using the new Brexit, Trump world and an excuse to abuse minorities. Those kind of bullies need to be put in their place by the law and indeed those on the right of politics. I don't think this is just a phenomena of the Liberal Left - the right when Obama was elected hardly acted any better. Problem is, something I noticed in the recent US elections, and in Brexit here, that engaging in reasoned debate rather than rhetoric and statements seems to have died. One of the curious things about the US Presidential Debates is that they weren't debates. Liberalism can only really work when its reasoned debate and engagement with the people. The issue of mass migration itself isn't the problem per se - its that the vast majority of people don't really benefit, and arguably lose out, as a result. Liberalism requires pragmatism to be effective - It shouldn't be touting gay rights on the basis say 'right thinking' but from a reasoned argument on the rights of citizens to fair treatment in society. But that's me, I think everything is a philosophical question.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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Hrolf The Ganger 17 Nov 16 3.02pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
I don't think this is just a phenomena of the Liberal Left - the right when Obama was elected hardly acted any better. Problem is, something I noticed in the recent US elections, and in Brexit here, that engaging in reasoned debate rather than rhetoric and statements seems to have died. One of the curious things about the US Presidential Debates is that they weren't debates. Liberalism can only really work when its reasoned debate and engagement with the people. The issue of mass migration itself isn't the problem per se - its that the vast majority of people don't really benefit, and arguably lose out, as a result. Liberalism requires pragmatism to be effective - It shouldn't be touting gay rights on the basis say 'right thinking' but from a reasoned argument on the rights of citizens to fair treatment in society. But that's me, I think everything is a philosophical question. I think that is pretty much it. Politics has indeed become more about broad ideologies and self interest and less about details and debate. Social media has created a battle ground rather than a debating chamber.
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jamiemartin721 Reading 17 Nov 16 3.06pm | |
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See I like right wingers, as they sharpen up my arguing skills. Its why the HoL is better than the BBS - Its more enagaging to argue, than to nod in quiet agreement. Plus maybe we all learn something along the way.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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jamiemartin721 Reading 17 Nov 16 3.07pm | |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
I think that is pretty much it. Politics has indeed become more about broad ideologies and self interest and less about details and debate. Social media has created a battle ground rather than a debating chamber. Lazy thinking and soft reasoning, make politics about how you say things, rather than what you are saying. Can't stand lazy thinking and reasoning - unless its funny - it shows a lack of character.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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Dan1994 Wallington 17 Nov 16 3.36pm | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Thank you for your pleasant opening gambit.... you are a charmer. I mentioned Easton as well as St Pauls.... see the above article from the Evening Post (and was highlighted on local TV) about a shooting which the police say they're keeping an open mind on, but we all know it involves drugs. There have been quite a few reports of gun crime ad stabbings in and around Stapleton Road this past few years. As for St Pauls becoming gentrified I am not yet convinced, but I confess I haven't actually driven through it lately. Montpelier/Stokes Croft/Cheltenham Rd areas are a bit different to City Road St Pauls and immediate environs though. I doubt that you'd be made welcome in any of the pubs there? Having said that I agree that you would probably not be made welcome in the pubs of Southmead or Knowle West (particularly if you were foreign looking or had a non Bristolian accent). But your conclusion that danger lurks in every city in the UK doesn't reassure me and that demonstrates a massive sea change in behaviour since I was out and about at "silly O'clock on the lash in my youth. I'm a lovely lad, Hoof, I promise Easton is a s***hole, but it's always been a s***hole from my understanding with Bristolians that I know/have met. In fact, Stapleton Road was the most dangerous road in the UK about 10 years ago when the Aggi Crew were about. Now, Bristol doesn't even register in the top ten in gun crime (http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/gun-crime-capital-uk-been-7375468.html) and Horsefair is the only Bristol street that ranks in the top 50 in the UK in terms of crimes on one particular street (http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/britains-crime-hotspots-revealed-50-5852573.html). St. Paul's is getting gentrified, no two ways about it. My house I was renting in Montpelier is actually now cheaper than my friend who rents in St. Paul's now (went from £72 to £90 pwpp in a year). I been into some of the pubs about, and I never got much trouble, but then I'm used to getting weird looks. One of my mate's went to the semi-famous Fulford pub in Knowle West (I believe)... he said it was an interesting place (and he's a ginger giant from outside of Leicester). And to be honest, where did you go out in your youth? 60s Carshalton is hardly the same as Easton at any time in the past several decades. Edited by Dan1994 (17 Nov 2016 3.38pm)
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Cucking Funt Clapham on the Back 17 Nov 16 4.00pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
See I like right wingers, as they sharpen up my arguing skills. Its why the HoL is better than the BBS - Its more enagaging to argue, than to nod in quiet agreement. Plus maybe we all learn something along the way. I have much to teach you, my young padwan.
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chris123 hove actually 17 Nov 16 4.41pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
I don't think this is just a phenomena of the Liberal Left - the right when Obama was elected hardly acted any better. Problem is, something I noticed in the recent US elections, and in Brexit here, that engaging in reasoned debate rather than rhetoric and statements seems to have died. One of the curious things about the US Presidential Debates is that they weren't debates. Liberalism can only really work when its reasoned debate and engagement with the people. The issue of mass migration itself isn't the problem per se - its that the vast majority of people don't really benefit, and arguably lose out, as a result. Liberalism requires pragmatism to be effective - It shouldn't be touting gay rights on the basis say 'right thinking' but from a reasoned argument on the rights of citizens to fair treatment in society. But that's me, I think everything is a philosophical question. It is no longer the same audience.
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steeleye20 Croydon 17 Nov 16 5.26pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
See I like right wingers, as they sharpen up my arguing skills. Its why the HoL is better than the BBS - Its more enagaging to argue, than to nod in quiet agreement. Plus maybe we all learn something along the way. Its not engaging to argue when your friend converts every subject under the sun to a diatribe on immigration.
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Hrolf The Ganger 17 Nov 16 5.59pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
See I like right wingers, as they sharpen up my arguing skills. Its why the HoL is better than the BBS - Its more enagaging to argue, than to nod in quiet agreement. Plus maybe we all learn something along the way. You got that right. They have allowed the lunatics to take over the asylum.
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