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Martin Amis

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serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 26 Oct 15 12.33pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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chris123 Flag hove actually 26 Oct 15 12.40pm Send a Private Message to chris123 Add chris123 as a friend

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


While being a life long Labour supporter saying what he thinks. You seem to be tackling the man rather than the ball.

 

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We are goin up! Flag Coulsdon 26 Oct 15 12.45pm Send a Private Message to We are goin up! Add We are goin up! as a friend

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)

 


The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 26 Oct 15 1.03pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Quote We are goin up! at 26 Oct 2015 12.45pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)


Yeah but are they really the greatest minds? 40% of Oxbridge graduates went to public school, so unsurprisingly it's really the richest minds that are dominating our society. And then there's the point that, especially in politics, a detailed knowledge of Classics and an ability to do well in some exams aren't necessarily going to make you a good public servant.

Democratic capitalism is built upon the idea that anyone from any background can establish themselves at the top of society through hard work. Yet when you look at our society, and see just how dominated it is by publicly educated Oxbridge graduates, you realise that it's nonsense in the main. That's why what Amis says sticks in the teeth: when you see someone like Corbyn, who has worked quietly but incredibly hard throughout his political life get close to the top, they are sneered at for not being 'one of us'. You see it in the media too, which is also made up of 50% Oxbridge graduates: the idea they can't ring up their old uni pals and ask them for the latest political scoops is terrifying.

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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Sportyteacher Flag London 26 Oct 15 1.03pm Send a Private Message to Sportyteacher Add Sportyteacher as a friend

Quote We are goin up! at 26 Oct 2015 12.45pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)

Martin Amis has too high opinion of himself. His views of Corbyn are only his own in that he doesn't speak or think on my behalf. Jog on, Martin!

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 26 Oct 15 1.07pm

Quote We are goin up! at 26 Oct 2015 12.45pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)

Only if you assume a meritocracy exists. It doesn't, essentially they aren't 'the best minds' they're the people generally who's parents bought them the best education and had the best access to 'cultural capital'. Excepting maybe a very small percentage of people, what matters more than 'your mind' is the socio-economic background, access to common culture, being able to read well and educational access children have.

There is a reason why people pay very big fees to get their kids a 'private education', and the best schools in the country, generally aren't comprehensives.

We tend to assume that everyone is well educated, but its not really true, children with parents of a high educational standard tend to achieve much higher levels of education themselves, as they are exposed to 'cultural influences' and of course their own parents capacity to provide educational input to their child. Its not a genetic thing, its the fact that bright, educated parents tend to expose their children to far more intellectual stimulation and culture than those who's own education was limited.

In a democracy it should not matter what your educational standard is, anyone should 'be considerable' for a role as an MP or even PM. Their job is to represent the people, not to rule them. A prime minister who was a plumber with only his city and guilds should be as valid as one who went to Eton and Oxford.


 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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Yellow Card - User has been warned of conduct on the messageboards Hrolf The Ganger Flag 26 Oct 15 1.18pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Quote jamiemartin721 at 26 Oct 2015 1.07pm

Quote We are goin up! at 26 Oct 2015 12.45pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)

Only if you assume a meritocracy exists. It doesn't, essentially they aren't 'the best minds' they're the people generally who's parents bought them the best education and had the best access to 'cultural capital'. Excepting maybe a very small percentage of people, what matters more than 'your mind' is the socio-economic background, access to common culture, being able to read well and educational access children have.

There is a reason why people pay very big fees to get their kids a 'private education', and the best schools in the country, generally aren't comprehensives.

We tend to assume that everyone is well educated, but its not really true, children with parents of a high educational standard tend to achieve much higher levels of education themselves, as they are exposed to 'cultural influences' and of course their own parents capacity to provide educational input to their child. Its not a genetic thing, its the fact that bright, educated parents tend to expose their children to far more intellectual stimulation and culture than those who's own education was limited.

In a democracy it should not matter what your educational standard is, anyone should 'be considerable' for a role as an MP or even PM. Their job is to represent the people, not to rule them. A prime minister who was a plumber with only his city and guilds should be as valid as one who went to Eton and Oxford.



Quite true.

Unfortunately, if you were to replace the ruling class with plumbers all that would happen is that their kids would get a private education and so on and we would soon be back to square one.

Survival of the fittest extends to offspring even when they aren't really up to it.

 

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dannyh Flag wherever I lay my hat....... 26 Oct 15 1.55pm Send a Private Message to dannyh Add dannyh as a friend

Quote jamiemartin721 at 26 Oct 2015 1.07pm

Quote We are goin up! at 26 Oct 2015 12.45pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)

Only if you assume a meritocracy exists. It doesn't, essentially they aren't 'the best minds' they're the people generally who's parents bought them the best education and had the best access to 'cultural capital'. Excepting maybe a very small percentage of people, what matters more than 'your mind' is the socio-economic background, access to common culture, being able to read well and educational access children have.

I call bulls*** Jamie, Richard Branson left school at 16, is now worth 5.1 Billion, Price Edward had the best education money could by and left school with one C and two D's at a level. Point being its not about money buying you an education sure better schools help, but there are thousands of people who had a state school education and went on to get degrees and become masters of industry, you juct choose to ignore them as it goes against the lefty ideal of elitism in education.

There is a reason why people pay very big fees to get their kids a 'private education', and the best schools in the country, generally aren't comprehensives.

The best Pupils are not always the wealthy ones either. A good school does not garuntee a good pupil.

We tend to assume that everyone is well educated, but its not really true, children with parents of a high educational standard tend to achieve much higher levels of education themselves, as they are exposed to 'cultural influences' and of course their own parents capacity to provide educational input to their child. Its not a genetic thing, its the fact that bright, educated parents tend to expose their children to far more intellectual stimulation and culture than those who's own education was limited.

Summation on your part. How do you explain the kids that come from broken homes that go on to get degrees ?

In a democracy it should not matter what your educational standard is, anyone should 'be considerable' for a role as an MP or even PM. Their job is to represent the people, not to rule them. A prime minister who was a plumber with only his city and guilds should be as valid as one who went to Eton and Oxford.

So your saying a plumber with city and guild should be on trade delagations to gain foreign investment to their ward or constituancey !? they'd all end up pissed in the dam with a various amouont of extenisve STD's !



 


"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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matt_himself Flag Matataland 26 Oct 15 2.30pm Send a Private Message to matt_himself Add matt_himself as a friend

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


He is not being a 'prick'. He is giving his opinion on something important - whether someone who could (God forbid) become PM has the mental dexerity to do the job.

Your problem is that Amis is crititising someone who you clearly associate with and instead of defending Corbyn's abilities, have reverted to type and launched an attack 'Oxbridge' and the establishment.

 


"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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We are goin up! Flag Coulsdon 26 Oct 15 2.47pm Send a Private Message to We are goin up! Add We are goin up! as a friend

Quote Sportyteacher at 26 Oct 2015 1.03pm

Quote We are goin up! at 26 Oct 2015 12.45pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)

Martin Amis has too high opinion of himself. His views of Corbyn are only his own in that he doesn't speak or think on my behalf. Jog on, Martin!


And what you're saying is that he shouldn't be allowed to express that opinion?

 


The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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JL85 Flag London,SE9 26 Oct 15 2.49pm Send a Private Message to JL85 Add JL85 as a friend

Quote dannyh at 26 Oct 2015 1.55pm

Quote jamiemartin721 at 26 Oct 2015 1.07pm

Quote We are goin up! at 26 Oct 2015 12.45pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Oct 2015 12.33pm

Not dead, just being a prick: [Link]

The positions of power in this country are overwhelmingly held by people from Oxbridge. Nearly 3 out of 4 judges went there, 1 in 2 diplomats, 60% of the cabinet. The very idea that the most senior political position in the country may go to someone who isn't one of their own is clearly pretty scary for people like Amis, who of course defied his own public school/intellectual family/Oxbridge education and became a complete f*cking idiot churning out dull novels.


I don't really have a problem with our best minds running the country, personally. Do you think there should be an MP with a meeja studies degree from the Staines Metropolitan Roundabout University in their place instead?

Edited by We are goin up! (26 Oct 2015 12.46pm)

Only if you assume a meritocracy exists. It doesn't, essentially they aren't 'the best minds' they're the people generally who's parents bought them the best education and had the best access to 'cultural capital'. Excepting maybe a very small percentage of people, what matters more than 'your mind' is the socio-economic background, access to common culture, being able to read well and educational access children have.

I call bulls*** Jamie, Richard Branson left school at 16, is now worth 5.1 Billion, Price Edward had the best education money could by and left school with one C and two D's at a level. Point being its not about money buying you an education sure better schools help, but there are thousands of people who had a state school education and went on to get degrees and become masters of industry, you juct choose to ignore them as it goes against the lefty ideal of elitism in education.

There is a reason why people pay very big fees to get their kids a 'private education', and the best schools in the country, generally aren't comprehensives.

The best Pupils are not always the wealthy ones either. A good school does not garuntee a good pupil.

We tend to assume that everyone is well educated, but its not really true, children with parents of a high educational standard tend to achieve much higher levels of education themselves, as they are exposed to 'cultural influences' and of course their own parents capacity to provide educational input to their child. Its not a genetic thing, its the fact that bright, educated parents tend to expose their children to far more intellectual stimulation and culture than those who's own education was limited.

Summation on your part. How do you explain the kids that come from broken homes that go on to get degrees ?

In a democracy it should not matter what your educational standard is, anyone should 'be considerable' for a role as an MP or even PM. Their job is to represent the people, not to rule them. A prime minister who was a plumber with only his city and guilds should be as valid as one who went to Eton and Oxford.

So your saying a plumber with city and guild should be on trade delagations to gain foreign investment to their ward or constituancey !? they'd all end up pissed in the dam with a various amouont of extenisve STD's !



The difference being Branson is from a wealthy background and had the capital to cover any losses in his start up businesses, a luxury that doesn't extend to your average person.

Alan Sugar is much better example. Not the point though, the point is the percentage. The working class, make up a vast majority of the population yet account for such a tiny percentage of MP's, Barristers, City Traders etc.

The point is, the opportunities are there, just not for everyone.

 

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jamiemartin721 Flag Reading 26 Oct 15 3.57pm

Quote dannyh at 26 Oct 2015 1.55pm

I call bulls*** Jamie, Richard Branson left school at 16, is now worth 5.1 Billion, Price Edward had the best education money could by and left school with one C and two D's at a level. Point being its not about money buying you an education sure better schools help, but there are thousands of people who had a state school education and went on to get degrees and become masters of industry, you juct choose to ignore them as it goes against the lefty ideal of elitism in education.

Branson tends to leave out the fact his parents were actually quite well off, and that the success of Virgin records was based on a 'tax fraud' that would have bankrupted his company, had his mother not remortgaged her house to pay the unpaid tax bills. By that point the Virgin Brand for mail order records was established, but his success was essentially based on a failed tax fraud.

Income helps a lot, because contrary to popular opinion, you can buy your kids a better education. It won't turn an dim witted kid into a genius, but as a generalization people who attend private school, even on scholarships or sponsor programs, achieve higher academic achievement, on the whole, compared to people who don't.

Quote dannyh at 26 Oct 2015 1.55pm

The best Pupils are not always the wealthy ones either. A good school does not garuntee a good pupil.

Of course not, but it will generally also give you much better contacts in terms of networking and access generally to better teachers, smaller classes and more focused instruction and so on. It won't make you more 'intelligent' but it will make much more of what you have (and if you happen to be behind, have dyslexia or learning disorders, then specialist private education is even more valuable).

Where as the traditional comprehensive tends towards factors such as large classes, a broader range of teacher quality, lower standards of individual tutoring and so on.

Quote dannyh at 26 Oct 2015 1.55pm
Summation on your part. How do you explain the kids that come from broken homes that go on to get degrees ?

Its a generalization, but in my experience, they tend to work harder than other pupils, or pursue education because they see it as a way out. Also its worth noting that a dysfunctional family can serve to 'accelerate the maturity' of children, as they become more functional in fulfilling traditional adult roles, such as helping siblings with homework etc.

Quote dannyh at 26 Oct 2015 1.55pm
So your saying a plumber with city and guild should be on trade delagations to gain foreign investment to their ward or constituancey !? they'd all end up pissed in the dam with a various amouont of extenisve STD's !

Yes, if he's the MP, as the role of the MP is representation of the people. The actual work of the trade delegation is largely done by civil servants and those the MP oversees.


 


"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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