I kind of am, my wife is the only dependent I have and am likely to ever have. There are two cats and that's about it. Everyone else, has their own lives to live how they want. Even partners when you think about it. Anyone who has foolishly made themselves dependent on my existence, has tragically misunderstood me and who I am. My only concern really is the two cats.

Of course that's just me. I don't really care too much how other people choose to live their lives.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
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Of course, equally, people who have kids now are in a position where to equate meaning from that decision, they have to place great importance on the well being of their children (and its kind of unacceptable to say that 'it was a terrible mistake' - you just have to make the most of it).

I wouldn't say I don't understand 'living for others', I'd say I understand it well enough to say 'that's not for me'. If other people want kids, I don't really care, that's their choice.

My cats, for example, are very important to me, probably more important to me, than your kids, but that's just a subjective attachment thing, I'm pretty sure your kids are more important to you, than my cats.

I don't even object to paying tax that goes out on things like Education, Child support etc, even whilst they up the tax on booze and fags.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

If a person is honest enough to admit that they don't feel they would be capable of giving their all to their kids I think it's a very adult decision to make. Many are totally the wrong match for raising kids, do so anyway and just damage a life in the process.

Edited by oldcodger (29 Oct 2015 6.58pm)

If one of my kids had terminal cancer it would take me all of two seconds to decide to have it for them, if that were a possibility.

Call it love, protection, or both, but whatever it is that feeling of someone else being more precious than your own life is kinda humbling.

Ricky Gervais is another cat-lover who has decided not to have kids. I'm confused between respecting his decision but also feeling a bit disappointed as I think he is depriving a couple of children of having a great dad and him not realising the sheer amount of fun he is missing out on, but also it is none of my bloody business.

Put it this way - I don't believe he would give up his own life to save his moggie's.

Big chest and massive boobs

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Well yes, because evolutionary speaking, the necessity of the survival of genetic material from one generation to the next, is the core basis of being. It would make sense that we care very much about the well being of our off spring.

Of course its not a universal thing, that people love their children either beyond all other things, or that the expression of that love and emotion promotes the well being of that child. Plenty of people harm and kill their own children. Also of course people form incredible degrees of love for adopted children as well.

You say its different and more, it might be, I can't really answer that. I suspect that its different, rather than more, and tied to a much deeper drive and need than to family (we expect to replace our parents, on some level we're aware we will lose our partner and pets but children we can very reasonably expect to never 'leave us' (for most of us, our children will survive us, and the capacity of experiencing love without threat of loss of love, rejection or abandonment is very real).

I think its their experience. I think it demeans people to say that their experience is somehow inferior because it differs to your own - I know people with kids who hold both negative and positive views, and hated the fact that people 'gloss over' how f**king hard having kids is, how much strain it puts on a relationship and life. I don't really consider selfishness a problem, but agree in regard to self indulgence.

Probably true, especially the last part. That said, its not for everyone, and from an outside perspective it seems that its really hard work and a massive responsibility, and that's definitely not for me - no matter how good 'that feeling is', I'd still make a terrible parent.

Of course for some people that bond isn't the same. I think that some people are definitely very suited to being parents, but that a lot of people have children for much less noble reasons. I don't necessarily think those who don't feel that bond are flawed (my mum didn't feel that feeling for months).

Then again I've said exactly the same thing about LSD and Magic Mushrooms.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]