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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 10 Jul 16 6.43pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Kermit8


Put it this way - if the Far Right and Far Left had voted to Remain and Remain won then I, as an inny, would be thinking what the hell have I just done? Agreeing with that lot!Those b@stards fvck up everything they come into contact with with their suspect judgement and idiot actions.

Will this be the first time they have been involved in something positive long term? Have they called it correct at last?


Nah. Bollocks to thta. Of course they haven't.

So you wouldn't like to agree with people who you normally disagree with?

That's a bit dogmatic.

 

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View dannyh's Profile dannyh Flag wherever I lay my hat....... 10 Jul 16 9.45pm Send a Private Message to dannyh Add dannyh as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

I have always been a one person one vote person to elect our representatives, although I detest the whole idea of using plebiscites. I have always thought that being stupid ought not disbar anyone from being able to have an opinion and to cast a vote.

Many of the comments in this thread have challenged that approach, none less than the one above.

Those on the far right and the far left are both, in my opinion, equally stupid. It is time that the middle ground gets organised, for they are by far the biggest group. As there are strong signs that this is happening there is at least some hope that some good can come out of all of this.

I predict a split in both of our major parties and a general election in which a new deal with the EU will be on the table which would enable us to remain inside. As soon as that possibility becomes a probability the markets will recover and all will be well.

The right will winge and moan but they are just a substantial minority.

Another I'm cleverer than you post insult from the left.

First off i'm not far right or anything like it, I just happen to have made an informed opinion that in the long run, we will be better off away from the EU as in my opinion, it is a failing experiment for big business, with a failing currency. I also do not subscribe to the doomsday prophecy being banded about by you and johnny "knows everything about feck all" Boy.

The fact that I disagree with you does not make me any less of an intellect than your good self, I do not consider you or Johnny boy to be of sub human intelligence although you remain people just can't help but make comments about brexit voters as knuckle dragging idiots, 17.5 million is a lot of knuckle draggers is it not?

You've had beef with me before as I dared disagree with you. You ought to watch your blood pressure me old chum.

 


"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 10 Jul 16 11.35pm Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by dannyh

Another I'm cleverer than you post insult from the left.

First off i'm not far right or anything like it, I just happen to have made an informed opinion that in the long run, we will be better off away from the EU as in my opinion, it is a failing experiment for big business, with a failing currency. I also do not subscribe to the doomsday prophecy being banded about by you and johnny "knows everything about feck all" Boy.

The fact that I disagree with you does not make me any less of an intellect than your good self, I do not consider you or Johnny boy to be of sub human intelligence although you remain people just can't help but make comments about brexit voters as knuckle dragging idiots, 17.5 million is a lot of knuckle draggers is it not?

You've had beef with me before as I dared disagree with you. You ought to watch your blood pressure me old chum.


I am not from "the left". I haven't voted Labour since I was a spotty teenager and that was more than 50 years ago. I have been solidly Tory all my life, believe in free enterprise and parliamentary democracy. The problem with the right is that they never think they are there. Just as a racist or a homophobe denies it, so do the right. They are always think they are in the middle and represent mainstream opinion. They don't and your posts say everything that needs to be said.

Maybe you were one of those who made their decision on an opinion that the UK would be better off economically outside of the EU. I do not though think it can legitimately be described as "informed". The really informed opinions, from those whose job it is to be informed, were all the other way. What you possess is nostalgia and hope, which in these circumstances are worthless commodities.

That there are a few like you is undoubtedly true. There are some of you down the pub, and on here. UKIP types exist. Unfortunately. However they are not enough to gain 52% of the 72% who voted. That required people to vote on lies and promises that can never be fulfilled, plus others making protest votes about austerity and blaming the first target they could kick.

No-one voted remain as a protest so remove the false leave votes and remain won by a substantial margin. This is an issue which will not just be swept away by people determined to justify the unjustifiable by way of a flawed referendum. There are many moves afoot already. The political turmoil of the past 2 weeks is directly related to the need to overturn the decision. You "old chum" have a lot yet to learn. My blood pressure is fine. It is the determination levels of people like me that has been raised. True middle England has woken up.

 


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View dannyh's Profile dannyh Flag wherever I lay my hat....... 10 Jul 16 11.55pm Send a Private Message to dannyh Add dannyh as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle


I am not from "the left". I haven't voted Labour since I was a spotty teenager and that was more than 50 years ago. I have been solidly Tory all my life, believe in free enterprise and parliamentary democracy. The problem with the right is that they never think they are there. Just as a racist or a homophobe denies it, so do the right. They are always think they are in the middle and represent mainstream opinion. They don't and your posts say everything that needs to be said.

Maybe you were one of those who made their decision on an opinion that the UK would be better off economically outside of the EU. I do not though think it can legitimately be described as "informed". The really informed opinions, from those whose job it is to be informed, were all the other way. What you possess is nostalgia and hope, which in these circumstances are worthless commodities.

That there are a few like you is undoubtedly true. There are some of you down the pub, and on here. UKIP types exist. Unfortunately. However they are not enough to gain 52% of the 72% who voted. That required people to vote on lies and promises that can never be fulfilled, plus others making protest votes about austerity and blaming the first target they could kick.

No-one voted remain as a protest so remove the false leave votes and remain won by a substantial margin. This is an issue which will not just be swept away by people determined to justify the unjustifiable by way of a flawed referendum. There are many moves afoot already. The political turmoil of the past 2 weeks is directly related to the need to overturn the decision. You "old chum" have a lot yet to learn. My blood pressure is fine. It is the determination levels of people like me that has been raised. True middle England has woken up.

Dear God if you were chocolate you'd eat yourself, You really are acting like a spoiled little child who hasn't got his own way.

How can a referendum be flawed, that in itself is calling democracy flawed.

The only thing that's raised around here mate is your opinion of yourself.

"UKIP Types" your presumptions and sweeping statements say all one needs to know about you I'm afraid.

Edited by dannyh (11 Jul 2016 12.00am)

 


"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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View cardiff eagle's Profile cardiff eagle Flag 11 Jul 16 12.07am Send a Private Message to cardiff eagle Add cardiff eagle as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle


I am not from "the left". I haven't voted Labour since I was a spotty teenager and that was more than 50 years ago. I have been solidly Tory all my life, believe in free enterprise and parliamentary democracy. The problem with the right is that they never think they are there. Just as a racist or a homophobe denies it, so do the right. They are always think they are in the middle and represent mainstream opinion. They don't and your posts say everything that needs to be said.

Maybe you were one of those who made their decision on an opinion that the UK would be better off economically outside of the EU. I do not though think it can legitimately be described as "informed". The really informed opinions, from those whose job it is to be informed, were all the other way. What you possess is nostalgia and hope, which in these circumstances are worthless commodities.

That there are a few like you is undoubtedly true. There are some of you down the pub, and on here. UKIP types exist. Unfortunately. However they are not enough to gain 52% of the 72% who voted. That required people to vote on lies and promises that can never be fulfilled, plus others making protest votes about austerity and blaming the first target they could kick.

No-one voted remain as a protest so remove the false leave votes and remain won by a substantial margin. This is an issue which will not just be swept away by people determined to justify the unjustifiable by way of a flawed referendum. There are many moves afoot already. The political turmoil of the past 2 weeks is directly related to the need to overturn the decision. You "old chum" have a lot yet to learn. My blood pressure is fine. It is the determination levels of people like me that has been raised. True middle England has woken up.

Equally remove the votes of those who voted remain because it was the easy (not right) thing to do in their minds and were back to square one. Accept what happened and move on.

Also, anyone who voted Tory and is now acting devastated at us leaving the EU is a major hypocrite. They were the only mainstream party to offer a referendum and if being in the EU meant that much to you you wouldn't have voted for them just to avoid the risk of this happening, no matter how unlikely it seemed at the time. Instead, you did vote Tory, got the referendum and lost and now act devastated. It's probably project fear that's got you upset but you are as culpable as those who voted out in the outcome of us leaving the EU.

 

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View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 11 Jul 16 8.35am Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by dannyh

Dear God if you were chocolate you'd eat yourself, You really are acting like a spoiled little child who hasn't got his own way.

How can a referendum be flawed, that in itself is calling democracy flawed.

The only thing that's raised around here mate is your opinion of yourself.

"UKIP Types" your presumptions and sweeping statements say all one needs to know about you I'm afraid.

Edited by dannyh (11 Jul 2016 12.00am)

The UK has a parliamentary democracy and not a process in which plebiscite are used to quieten the loud mouths on the right. Plebiscites are far too unreliable a test of public opinion on events this important. When you choose the winner of X factor it doesn't really matter that the voters are influenced by how fat they are, or the colour of their shirt. When voting on what the future of our country is, for our children and grandchildren it does. We need our parliament to act, as they are required to act, in our best interests.

This is nothing at all to do about my own situation. I am personally much better off now than before the referendum as about half my assets are held in currencies other than sterling and they are all now for sale.

My concerns are for us all. Ask yourself this. If all the predictions made by remain about what would happen in the immediate aftermath were true, and all have been now proven to be true, then is it not reasonable to expect that ALL the predictions are also true. Those predictions were not a "project fear"! They were genuine warnings which were ignored and those who continue to suggest they are untrue are simply in denial. Not for nothing have most of the major leave players run away leaving only the political opportunists in place. They did not expect to win and they know very well that what people like you expect cannot be delivered.

 


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View Wisbech Eagle's Profile Wisbech Eagle Flag Truro Cornwall 11 Jul 16 8.45am Send a Private Message to Wisbech Eagle Add Wisbech Eagle as a friend

Originally posted by cardiff eagle

Equally remove the votes of those who voted remain because it was the easy (not right) thing to do in their minds and were back to square one. Accept what happened and move on.

Also, anyone who voted Tory and is now acting devastated at us leaving the EU is a major hypocrite. They were the only mainstream party to offer a referendum and if being in the EU meant that much to you you wouldn't have voted for them just to avoid the risk of this happening, no matter how unlikely it seemed at the time. Instead, you did vote Tory, got the referendum and lost and now act devastated. It's probably project fear that's got you upset but you are as culpable as those who voted out in the outcome of us leaving the EU.

People like me resented the referendum but saw it as a way of shutting up the right of the party for good and pushing UKIP into the long grass. A combination of events caused the disaster. It is not what the majority really want, of that I am totally convinced. The vote on the day was lost. That is accepted. The battle to save the country has only just begun. Politics doesn't end just because of a referendum vote. Your opponents are entitled to argue and they will. New governments can acquire new mandates. "Project fear" was yet another leave lie. The fear was real. They were warnings which have all been shown subsequently to be true. If those warnings, given by people whose jobs depend on actually understanding these things, have proved true so far then why on earth should their predictions for the longer term be wrong? They are not and those who continue to use hope as their argument are simply in denial.

 


For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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View Kermit8's Profile Kermit8 Flag Hevon 11 Jul 16 9.28am Send a Private Message to Kermit8 Add Kermit8 as a friend

Ian Hislop said the other day "that the case can still be argued for remain even in referendum defeat". Act like The Opposition. He is of course correct. We have that right. Freedom of speech and all.

I notice though that quite a few Leavers want us to be quiet and just accept whatever is coming. Bit undemocratic that.

So it's only fair that as you go on your likely destructive course that the jeering and scrutiny is heard loud and clear: "you don't know what you're doing"

You won't mind though will you as you are 100% confident in the course you have set sail on for the UK (or what will be left of it).

I hope Boris, Nigel and Michael (soon) are enjoying their break and relaxing. Thanks, chaps. A half-finished job well done.

Andrea Leadsom? You've got to be having a laugh?

 


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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 11 Jul 16 12.19pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

People like me resented the referendum but saw it as a way of shutting up the right of the party for good and pushing UKIP into the long grass. A combination of events caused the disaster. It is not what the majority really want, of that I am totally convinced. The vote on the day was lost. That is accepted. The battle to save the country has only just begun. Politics doesn't end just because of a referendum vote. Your opponents are entitled to argue and they will. New governments can acquire new mandates. "Project fear" was yet another leave lie. The fear was real. They were warnings which have all been shown subsequently to be true. If those warnings, given by people whose jobs depend on actually understanding these things, have proved true so far then why on earth should their predictions for the longer term be wrong? They are not and those who continue to use hope as their argument are simply in denial.

You really are living in a delusion created by your own arrogance.

Firstly the idea of pushing the opinions of a significant part of the population "into the long grass" really does display your contempt for others who don't share your blinkered view.
You still can't see that the projections of disaster post Brexit put forward by the Remain campaign were just that. There is and always was no certainty to any of them.
I suspect that some people like yourself actually want the country to go down the pan just so You can say I told you so.

Don't hold your breath.

 

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View leifandersonshair's Profile leifandersonshair Flag Newport 11 Jul 16 12.53pm Send a Private Message to leifandersonshair Add leifandersonshair as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You really are living in a delusion created by your own arrogance.

Firstly the idea of pushing the opinions of a significant part of the population "into the long grass" really does display your contempt for others who don't share your blinkered view.
You still can't see that the projections of disaster post Brexit put forward by the Remain campaign were just that. There is and always was no certainty to any of them.
I suspect that some people like yourself actually want the country to go down the pan just so You can say I told you so.

Don't hold your breath.

Proving rather accurate so far though, aren't they? Sterling at the lowest in 30 years, and more unstable than Bitcoin.

I don't think anyone wants the UK to fail- in or out of Europe. But I think you'll understand a certain amount of annoyance that all those experts, who were so blithely dismissed by the Leave camp? So far, they are proving spot on.

 

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View Hrolf The Ganger's Profile Hrolf The Ganger Flag 11 Jul 16 12.59pm Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger Add Hrolf The Ganger as a friend

Originally posted by leifandersonshair

Proving rather accurate so far though, aren't they? Sterling at the lowest in 30 years, and more unstable than Bitcoin.

I don't think anyone wants the UK to fail- in or out of Europe. But I think you'll understand a certain amount of annoyance that all those experts, who were so blithely dismissed by the Leave camp? So far, they are proving spot on.

We are a couple of weeks past the Referendum and uncertainty and pant wetting always causes instability in the markets.
This is very early days and no one expected anything else. Particularly with so many fear mongers still banging on.

 

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View OknotOK's Profile OknotOK Flag Cockfosters, London 11 Jul 16 1.04pm Send a Private Message to OknotOK Holmesdale Online Elite Member Add OknotOK as a friend

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

We are a couple of weeks past the Referendum and uncertainty and pant wetting always causes instability in the markets.
This is very early days and no one expected anything else. Particularly with so many fear mongers still banging on.

Fair assessment. It is much too early to make any real claims about what the impact will be. Indeed almost every Brexit campaigner admitted there would be at least short term economic pain, so it shouldn't be a surprise to anyone on either side.

In fact most Brexit economists (baring the largely discredited Minford) admitted that there is likely to be at least a small long term hit to the economy, but that the decision was about other things.

 


"It's almost like a moral decision. Except not really cos noone is going to find out," Jez, Peep Show

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